No loitering: Where you can(’t?) stand on the Downtown Mall

Wells Fargo took down the sign that said "no loitering" outside the bank on the Downtown Mall, and legal experts say the bank can't enforce such an edict.
Photo: Cara Salpini Wells Fargo took down the sign that said “no loitering” outside the bank on the Downtown Mall, and legal experts say the bank can’t enforce such an edict. Photo: Cara Salpini

On any given day Charlottesville’s Downtown Mall plays host to a crowd of visitors, locals and out-of-towners alike. The pedestrian walking street fills up with families going out to dinner, students doing homework in coffee shops and friends shopping together. With the Downtown Mall acting as a center for social activity, a “no loitering” sign on Wells Fargo Bank raises questions about the legality of preventing passersby from standing in a public place.

“It is not illegal to loiter,” legal expert Jeff Fogel says. “The Supreme Court has decided that a number of times.”

Fogel, who successfully sued the city for its ban on panhandling within 50 feet of a mall crossing, explains that loitering is only illegal if someone is loitering for an illegal purpose, such as prostitution or drug selling. He adds that for someone to be fined, the bank would have to prove that that person was loitering for an illegal purpose.

“The definition of loitering is, after all, just idly standing around,” Fogel says. “You can’t prevent someone from doing that.”

In the context of the Downtown Mall, where people are frequently standing around, a “no loitering” sign seems especially out of place. Kadiera Bennett, a manager at the Wells Fargo on the mall, explains that it was not her choice to put up the sign.

Kristy Marshall, Wells Fargo’s corporate communications spokesperson for Virginia, explains that having a “no loitering” sign is a corporate policy for all of their locations.

Marshall adds, “We normally don’t allow loitering around our stores just because it’s a bank and we have customers coming in with money and we want it to be a secure environment.”

While Wells Fargo’s policy may be aimed at ensuring the safety of customers, Lieutenant Steve Upman says, “There’s no loitering statute in Charlottesville or in Virginia.”  Upman, public information officer for the Charlottesville Police Department, acknowledges that there is a city code preventing solicitation within 15 feet of an ATM, but says there’s no similar code for loitering.

Fogel agrees that the bank most likely put the sign up to deter people from hanging around the area, but he points out that the bank cannot legally enforce a “no loitering” sign.

“They don’t want people hanging around their building?” Fogel says. “Tough luck. This is America. You can’t tell people where to stand. There’s no way they can enforce that. They can constitutionally prohibit loitering for something like prostitution. But you cannot be prevented from loitering. The bank can’t prohibit that. They don’t write the laws.”

Following C-VILLE’s inquiry, Wells Fargo has removed its sign.

This article was updated at 4:11 p.m. October 7.

Posted In:     News

Tags:     ,

Previous Post

Resident omission: Will Friendship Court be unfriended?

Next Post

Judge denies Jesse Matthew’s request for secret hearing

Our comments system is designed to foster a lively debate of ideas, offer a forum for the exchange of ad hoc information, and solicit honest, respectful feedback about the work we do. We’re glad you’re participating. Here are a few simple rules to follow, which should be relatively straightforward.

1) Don’t call people names or accuse them of things you cannot support.
2) Don’t direct foul language, racial slurs, or offensive terms at other commenters or our staff.
3) Don’t use the discussion on our site for commercial (or shameless personal) promotion.

We reserve the right to remove posts and ban commenters who violate any of the rules listed above, or the spirit of the discussion. We’re trying to create a safe space for a wide range of people to express themselves, and we believe that goal can only be achieved through thoughtful, sensitive editorial control.

If you have questions or comments about our policies or about a specific post, please send an e-mail to

Leave a Reply

1 Comment threads
0 Thread replies
Most reacted comment
Hottest comment thread
1 Comment authors
Jim Smith Recent comment authors
newest oldest most voted
Notify of
Jim Smith
Jim Smith

I have a friend, who is in a wheelchair because he lost his legs, and was waiting outside a local branch waiting for them to open. There are NO no loitering signs there, but the manager called the police on him. She said how did she know he wasn’t going to rob the bank. Other people waiting in their cars were not asked to leave. It sounds like discrimination, as my friend is disabled and Latino, the other people waiting were all white.